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Thread: 450 head set-up

  1. #1
    Legendary Member Mad Man Mark's Avatar
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    450 head set-up

    Hi guys...

    Got one for you...

    At both norm/stunt I set the pitch curves at 50.50.50.50.50
    I went thru "Finless Bob's" ccpm vids for a 450 (fly-bared)
    followed the instructions to the letter, and put the total travel up to within an 1/8th of an inch from the top at full travel, and every horizontal part of the head is level with the swash.
    in stunt center stick, the pitch +10/-6 didn't match by a long shot!

    So, I started over... this time, I set the servo linkage lengths to the correct specs (see attached), and went all the way back though the head and leveled everything again (I'm getting pretty fast at this now!)

    Then, I set up my normal docile pitches (norm) 45.50.55.65.75 as I did on my 1st build
    it wouldn't lift off the ground, so I checked the pitch with my pitch gauge at norm mid-stick
    I went back thru and readjusted my swash mix (pitch) to +10/-10 (about -8.5)... (this is in stunt)

    Now, in norm, at mid-stick (55%) I have maybe 2 degrees pitch.
    I adjusted my pitch in norm, at mid-stick to a little over 5 degrees, the radio tells me I'm at 78.4%

    How do I get this under control?
    I have all travel limits to 100%, no dr/expo during set-up
    right now my swash mix is at +60/-60/+73 (the 73 is for the +/- 10 in stunt)
    my throttle curves in norm/stunt are good

    I'm guessing to shorten my servo links one more time and do it all over again....

    HELP! lol
    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Mad Man Mark; 03-30-2012 at 11:43 PM. Reason: grammer
    If you see me running... You should be too!!!

    3M

    SPEKTRUM DX6i, DX8, Blade-mcx a few, Blade-cx2 x3, Falcon 40, CB180D, Blade-CP's a few, E-Sky HB, Exceed-g2, Walkera-V400D02, HK-450V2, EXI-450, CopterX-450, TRex 450 Sport Clone (Gold Digger), HK-600GT-FBL DFC and AR7200BX (BeastX)

  2. #2
    Legendary Member mmickels's Avatar
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    3M, you may need to move the balls out further on the servo arms to get more travel. You should be able to get a minimum of + and - 12 degrees of pitch.
    Mark the apprentice pilot.

    Blade msr, Tarot 450 FBL, Trex 500E FBL, Rush 700,
    IOM, Soling 50 (RC Sailboats)

  3. #3
    Legendary Member Mad Man Mark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mmickels View Post
    3M, you may need to move the balls out further on the servo arms to get more travel. You should be able to get a minimum of + and - 12 degrees of pitch.
    thanks mark! didn't even think of that one... "I'm still a newb"

    coarse, that won't change the mis-match +/- I still need help on that one everybody!

    Hey, here's another one I noticed...
    The guy I bought these 2 450s from EXI/CopterX has the servos mounted with the flange on the outside of the frame, that puts the linkages at an angle! (maybe he didn't know any better) I think I'll put them in right!

    BTW guys,

    should the distance from the servo horn center to the ball be about 13mm? or what is the max distance?
    If you see me running... You should be too!!!

    3M

    SPEKTRUM DX6i, DX8, Blade-mcx a few, Blade-cx2 x3, Falcon 40, CB180D, Blade-CP's a few, E-Sky HB, Exceed-g2, Walkera-V400D02, HK-450V2, EXI-450, CopterX-450, TRex 450 Sport Clone (Gold Digger), HK-600GT-FBL DFC and AR7200BX (BeastX)

  4. #4
    Legendary Member Mad Man Mark's Avatar
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    BTW,

    I have the flybar lock from what's his nuts (the same aluminum one Dude got)
    that thing is sweet! absolutely no swash intermix at H/L in Stunt!

    the laser came in the other day, so I used it to set up my tracking...
    even tho I didn't lift off, the tracking was spot on!
    If you see me running... You should be too!!!

    3M

    SPEKTRUM DX6i, DX8, Blade-mcx a few, Blade-cx2 x3, Falcon 40, CB180D, Blade-CP's a few, E-Sky HB, Exceed-g2, Walkera-V400D02, HK-450V2, EXI-450, CopterX-450, TRex 450 Sport Clone (Gold Digger), HK-600GT-FBL DFC and AR7200BX (BeastX)

  5. #5
    Legendary Member Mad Man Mark's Avatar
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    any body have a recommendation for the cyclic pitch numbers? 6 maybe?

    I was just thinking... give it 8 or so and dumb it down with the DR, or should I use the travel adjustment limits?


    LOL I know, I'm answering my own questions!

    TOO MUCH COFFEE!!!!! (ALL NIGHT LONG!)


    More Coffee please!

    wait a minute... that's how you set the damn cyclic numbers anyway!
    well as Rose Ann Rose Anna Danna says.... Never mind!

    coffee coffee coffee coffee coffee.....
    hey, I know.... CAPA CHINO!
    Last edited by Mad Man Mark; 03-31-2012 at 04:10 AM.
    If you see me running... You should be too!!!

    3M

    SPEKTRUM DX6i, DX8, Blade-mcx a few, Blade-cx2 x3, Falcon 40, CB180D, Blade-CP's a few, E-Sky HB, Exceed-g2, Walkera-V400D02, HK-450V2, EXI-450, CopterX-450, TRex 450 Sport Clone (Gold Digger), HK-600GT-FBL DFC and AR7200BX (BeastX)

  6. #6
    Diamond Member tony521's Avatar
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    Mark, put you pitch curves back to 50 all the way across. Make sure that all 3 servo arms are at 90*. First make sure that your main shaft is installed correctly(there is a correct way, check your manual). Put your swash mix to 60 for ail, elev and pitch. Now , with all that, put your stick at mid position, the gap between the bottom of the swash and the top main shaft bearing should be 10mm, now adjust all 3 servo links to that measurement. Make sure that your flybar cage is all level, if not , you have to adjust the long links to get that. once you get that, check your blade grip links and see if you have zero degrees on the blades at mid stick, if not, adjust those links to get that for both blades. Now once you get that, adjust your pitch curve to 40, 45, 50 75, 100. ok, now everything should be mechanically set. Now go to high throttle, with your pitch gage, see what degree it is, and adjust your pitch in the swash mix to obtain what pitch that you want, do this in Idle up mode ok., Once you get that, move to low stick and do the same thing. Now you should be even, top and bottom, if you did everything mechanically. The main thing is that 10mm gap with the swash and top bearing, ok. Once you have all this set, set your TC to 0, 50 , 60, 80, 90, 100. this curve should give you a nice enough headspeed for flying without bogging the motor. Good luck and let me know.
    Last edited by tony521; 03-31-2012 at 07:00 AM.
    TONY...


    Trex 450sev2 ,scorpion motor, castle ice lite 50amp esc, flybarless (hb800); trex450 sport, scorpion motor, castle ice lite 50 amp esc, flybarless (robird g31); Trex 250se (scorpion motor and castle 25amp esc)............

  7. #7
    Diamond Member tony521's Avatar
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    Name:  180px-0-deg-head-setup-1.jpg
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    this is what your setup should look like. Take care.
    TONY...


    Trex 450sev2 ,scorpion motor, castle ice lite 50amp esc, flybarless (hb800); trex450 sport, scorpion motor, castle ice lite 50 amp esc, flybarless (robird g31); Trex 250se (scorpion motor and castle 25amp esc)............

  8. #8
    Legendary Member Mad Man Mark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tony521 View Post
    Name:  180px-0-deg-head-setup-1.jpg
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    this is what your setup should look like. Take care.
    thanks tony... i've never seen the measurement from bottom of swash to top of bearing before (10mm)
    the heli came partially assembled... I'll check for correct shaft position 'top/bottom"

    thanks again for your advise guys!
    If you see me running... You should be too!!!

    3M

    SPEKTRUM DX6i, DX8, Blade-mcx a few, Blade-cx2 x3, Falcon 40, CB180D, Blade-CP's a few, E-Sky HB, Exceed-g2, Walkera-V400D02, HK-450V2, EXI-450, CopterX-450, TRex 450 Sport Clone (Gold Digger), HK-600GT-FBL DFC and AR7200BX (BeastX)

  9. #9
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    I like to set my max pitch angle as large as mechanically possible then tune down with DR. in an align clone + -12 degree is pretty good. over that is very difficult to get. cyclic also set as high as you can then tune it down with DR. one thing is your collective + cyclic you want to stay <=20-21 degree.
    so if you set your collective at 12, the set your cyclic around 8-9 max. Once you have it set up to +12 -12, make a note for yourself at least one linkage rod's length for future reference (like after a crash). each heli with different servo you may come out with a little different number to get that 12 degree. But as long as you say with the same cyclic servo , then that is a good reference for future use.

    I also use the the outer most hole on the sevo arm all the time too.

    PS. I think may be your limits are all at 100 is the problem. YOu set up your swash with the head off, to level the swash at mid stick using subtrim, at top and bottom stick using limit. THEN, put your head on, use your AFR to adjust your collective and cyclic to max without binding. Now if you get =-12 degree or uneven max + and - you can use either pitch curve to reduce the top /bottom stick pitch angle to what you want.
    But initially you want to do every thing you can to get the max pitch out of that heli. you can always tone it down with pitch curve/DR. and when you want more /less pitch, just reset your pitch curve/DR instead of having to go back reset the heli mechancally. the linkage length the 1st time set your heli up to 12 degree is important reference. Keep it. As I said, as long as you use the same cyclic servo, that won't change much at all in the future repair.
    Last edited by Kaos; 03-31-2012 at 11:37 AM.

  10. #10
    Legendary Member Mad Man Mark's Avatar
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    fantastic info Kaos...

    AFR?
    If you see me running... You should be too!!!

    3M

    SPEKTRUM DX6i, DX8, Blade-mcx a few, Blade-cx2 x3, Falcon 40, CB180D, Blade-CP's a few, E-Sky HB, Exceed-g2, Walkera-V400D02, HK-450V2, EXI-450, CopterX-450, TRex 450 Sport Clone (Gold Digger), HK-600GT-FBL DFC and AR7200BX (BeastX)

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